-
Maureen Brown I like the phrase .. “prayer is talking to God and meditation is listening”. Of course anytime the ‘i’ wills to get out of the way, and listen to an answer not of it’s own making, is a miraculous act of submission toward receiving conscious contact with the Divine.
-
Cindy Teevens Complete submission of yourself removes the need for conscious contact with the Divine, for no distance, no separation, or difference will be imagined Maureen Brown
-
Jeff Nance ah yes, that silence could fill all the volumes of all the books in all the libraries of the world. Silence never ceases to share its timeless wisdom!
-
Jeff Nance I practice a form of prayer/meditation in the definition above…I have found there is no need to project a Divine entity God/Holy Spirit to get in contact with…it is all inside of me…it IS me; my true natuere. It is about talking to myself in a way that undoes the misperceptions, undies those blocks of misthought. The course says Holy Spirit is nothing but our right minds anyways.
The silence happens, the spontaneous upsurges of joy happen along the way, but they are just a beautiful byproduct of the practice my intuition has guided me to. I am glad I can directly work with my mind, my thoughts, rather than imagine them to be impediments to spiritual growth, and attainment of the unattainable. -
Cindy Teevens The final undoing Jeff Nance, is the very idea of our separate individual self who even has spiritual growth or attainment. (the Bhagavad Gita 2:71-72 can be translated as “They are forever free who renounce all selfish desires and break away from the ego-cage of “I”, “me” and “mine” to be united with the Lord. This is the supreme state. Attain to this, and pass from death to immortality.”)
-
Jeff Nance Well, I interpret it differently. I believe in the immortal soul that is eternally distinct yet One with the essence of the supreme soul. There have always been dualists and monists and always will be, and many variations between them. Who can say with full authority how it will be. I am not of the absolute non-dualists school of thinking, but I feel that everyone gets the desires of their hearts. I like this translation of the passage: “A person who has given up all desires for sense gratification, who lives free from desires, who has given up all sense of proprietorship and is devoid of false ego — he alone can attain real peace. That is the way of the spiritual and godly life, after attaining which a man is not bewildered. If one is thus situated even at the hour of death, one can enter into the kingdom of God.”
-
Cindy Teevens Seems we are saying the same thing…”..who has given up all sense of proprietorship”… For no ownership, there is no owner. Giving up your separate existence is the only way to know your true identity with God.
-
Jeff Nance Well, it could also be interpreted that God is the true proprietor, and we are merely stewards here. It doesn’t have to be interpreted in a way that annihilates our identity.
-
Cindy Teevens There is no “each of us” … Listening to your friend speaking, can you separate his words from your hearing? Do not think about this! Check your actual experience, senses, and see – know it for yourself in your own direct, true experience. Mind only appears to separate, via thought. Reality is unseparated. When you believe a thought that appears to separates you, your sense of self is limited to somewhere around the head or body-mind. My sense of Self is not limited to anything anymore. I do not speak from anybody’s or any group’s religious beliefs. I do not believe. I speak from direct knowing. I used to live as thought, thoughts which said I was separate person. With that, there are two “i”s functioning, the true one ever present, and the false one, which comes and goes, ever morphing, improving, worsening, appearing to ever change, thus unreal–and it is not discerned as such, not discerned as “not me,” or unreal. Upon dissolution of the false, the ever present sense of I does not leave, (in fact it becomes stronger, clearer) but it is no longer limited. It is the same “I” for everyone – all others are seen and known to be It. There is no birth and therefore no death for that eternal Self, and being unseparated, there is no thing to threaten it. Realizing the fact of no others is the cosmic joke that causes all the laughter. When you give up being the illusion of being a limited individual, you realize your true identity and Reality as the infinite Universal. It’s a more than fair trade Jeff Nance
- Cindy Teevens It is ego that wants to retain its identity, as separate. It fears annihilation. The only thing that can be annihilated is the false, and you are not false. You have no such fear. The one expressing fear is not who you are; you are not who you think you are. The grandeur of your true Reality is just being eclipsed by a case of mistaken identity.